revamp

After Forever

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I loved After Forever. They weren't well known in the UK but I still got to see them live twice before they split. Once was at Download in 2007 & the other was as Rock City's Basement in Sept 2007.

I met Floor at their show in The Basement of Rock City in Nottingham & as the stage was so small too, I kept getting caught by her hair every time she banged her head 😄. It's such a tiny venue & looking back I'm so glad I went to that show & I was at the front.

 

http://www.metal-discovery.com/Live/AF_Sept2007/after_forever_rockcity_sept_2007.htm

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^------ How I wish I could have been there, as perhaps one the top 50 fans on an imaginary AF fandom chart, the fact you got to see them twice is incredible. I unfortunately only discovered them in 2012 when Floor joined Nightwish. My biggest musical regret is not seeing them before they broke up.

- - -

Here is something cool for those who missed out, someone got a really good quality version of the band logo on SpreadShirt. I will order a lot of these.

https://www.spreadshirt.com/after+forever+men-s+premium+t-shirt-D5b7afc05f9376457639f1c88?appearance=348&color=353D56

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As we eagerly await the next Nightwish DVD, I'm once again sad that there was never anything released by After Forever or ReVamp. I would love to sit back and relive those days with a release. I really hope one day there is a reunion show of some sort with both bands and maybe a combined effort DVD of After Forever and ReVamp to release. Although I won't get my hopes up, lol.

Whenever I see someone say they aren't impressed by Floor's vocals, it makes me sad. I know they have only heard her with Nightwish, which we all know doesn't utilize her voice to its greatest capabilities yet. I always refer them back to After Forever or ReVamp music. And then I begin to miss it, haha.

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4 hours ago, CenturyChild625 said:

Whenever I see someone say they aren't impressed by Floor's vocals, it makes me sad. I know they have only heard her with Nightwish, which we all know doesn't utilize her voice to its greatest capabilities yet. I always refer them back to After Forever or ReVamp music. And then I begin to miss it, haha.

To be fair: Nightwish does, only EFMB didn't.

But yeah, I'm also sad that neither After Forever nor ReVamp has a DVD out there. That would have been amazing. It's not that uncommon though, there are quite some bands out there that either lack a DVD or have only old or bad quality ones. Or even unreleased ones, because the label that holds the rights to the recording never bothered with a release (Mark Jansen recently posted on Facebook that this happend to Epica). But there are also some bands that record a show when they see that the end is near (like Theatre of Tragedy, Stream of Passion or even Nightwish at end of the Tarja era). I wish Floor's old bands would have at least done that.

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Hey! 

So being the massive Nightwish fan that I am, I recall around 2007 trying After Forever, and a couple of songs from the self titled were floating around on those free CDs that came out with metal magazines. I thought they were ok, but a 1K (or 1 star out of five) reviews from Kerrang put me off.

When Annette left the band, I was quite saddened and annoyed that they went to Floor. For some reason, every time I tried to get into something she had done I found her voice plain and rather boring. Her bands did nothing for me. But I came to love Floor and I totally felt that Nightwish was the right band for her after years with mediocrity.

Then last year, the Northward album came out and I LOVE IT! So I wondered, shall I give After Forever another shot? 

I have listened to Prison Of Desire and Decipher so many times now. I gave each a couple of spins to really let them get under my skin. 

 

WOOOOOOOOOOOW!!!!!!

 

I am in LOVE with them! Decipher is amazing. Like...the middle eastern styling, Floor sounds phenomenal, the songwriting is EPIC!

After twelve years knowing of this band, in the opening weeks of 2019 I became a fan.

I bought copies of Prison Of Desire and Decipher, and will continue on with the rest of their catalogue. I plan to do the same with Epica as well (who also took me years to appreciate, but The Holographic Principle blew my mind!).

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@laputa I can relate. There are many albums and even bands that I didn't care for or disliked when I first heard them, that I love now. Even Nightwish is like that for me. When I first heard it I thought something along the lines of "metal with an opera singer, what is this garbage". I tried again years later and then it became my favorite band. I think sometimes you're just not ready for a certain sound or style of music, and years later when your taste and listening skill have evolved it can suddenly sound amazing.

Anyway,  After Forever is great and so is Epica, it must be awesome to really get into their music for the first time :)

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14 minutes ago, NighttimeBird said:

@laputa I can relate. There are many albums and even bands that I didn't care for or disliked when I first heard them, that I love now. Even Nightwish is like that for me. When I first heard it I thought something along the lines of "metal with an opera singer, what is this garbage". I tried again years later and then it became my favorite band. I think sometimes you're just not ready for a certain sound or style of music, and years later when your taste and listening skill have evolved it can suddenly sound amazing.

Anyway,  After Forever is great and so is Epica, it must be awesome to really get into their music for the first time :)

It really is nice. I mean, through Nightwish and YouTube recommendations I have always been familiar with these bands but never hooked. But to be finally gelling with After Forever and Epica feels great, because I always have wanted to like them. Something never clicked but after getting into heavy metal bands like Machine Head, Paradise Lost, Opeth etc, coming back to Epica with there more metal sound has been great.

It annoys me when people say "if you love Nightwish how come you don't like Epica? They all sound the same!" They truly don't!

I also really love Leaves Eyes.

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23 hours ago, laputa said:

the songwriting is EPIC!

Mark Jansen being fully responsible for that :P I loved how Floor was capable enough to mantain the philosophical and introspective themes, they just kept out the (anti)religious stuff.

It also took me a few years (3, I guess) to get into AF, and it was also Floor's voice that didn't convince me back then. Of course, I just listened to "Energize Me" and "Emphasis". A friend of mine who happens to be a HUGE fan of Floor since AF times was pretty much insistant to make me listen Floor's real talent, so I gave Prison of Desire a chance and I was mindblown by all those outstanding vocal melodies and powerful tracks.

19 hours ago, laputa said:

"if you love Nightwish how come you don't like Epica? They all sound the same!" They truly don't!

True fact. Actually, I met a lot of non-metalheads who told me they sound exactly the same.... just because there's a female lead vocalist, a band doing some noise at the back, bombastic orchestra and some choir here and there (well, in Epica case would be some choir ELSEWHERE in any track). They can't even notice the difference between power/melodic metal from death metal, an epic latin choir from just a few instances of a choir saying nothing but "oh" (as in those few NW songs who features a choir), the song structure and don't even get me started with the lyrical content. Same goes for AF, except for a couple of songs in their last album.

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So I think I am falling in love with Epica and After Forever hard! So far, I have only played the two After Forever albums with Mark Jansen, and I then played The Phantom Agony by Epica only to find it reminded me so much of After Forever I thought of it as the third Mark Jansen After Forever album. It was great.

So today on YouTube I played bits and pieces of stuff, and a live song from Invisible Circles came up. Now I know it is a concept album, but still the lyrics impressed me. I thought maybe o won't like anything much post-Decipher but I thought it was an astounding song and Floor was amazing live!

Here is the video:

 

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Invisible Circles is one of my favourite albums ever, precisely beause of the concept and how masterfully Floor has grasped this topic through her lyrics.

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9 hours ago, laputa said:

So I think I am falling in love with Epica and After Forever hard! So far, I have only played the two After Forever albums with Mark Jansen, and I then played The Phantom Agony by Epica only to find it reminded me so much of After Forever I thought of it as the third Mark Jansen After Forever album. It was great.

So today on YouTube I played bits and pieces of stuff, and a live song from Invisible Circles came up. Now I know it is a concept album, but still the lyrics impressed me. I thought maybe o won't like anything much post-Decipher but I thought it was an astounding song and Floor was amazing live!

Here is the video:

 

Oh my goodness her voice there.  Thoroughly enjoyed listening to that song.  (Apparently I need to listen to more After Forever now...)

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Here is my thoughts on Invisible Circles. I have bought the first two albums, and plan to get the rest:

After Forever- Invisible Circles (6/10) I felt a little generous giving this a 6. After two absolutely amazing albums, in which After Forever stand tall alongside the likes of early Nightwish and Within Temptation, Mark Jansen, brother of Floor and arguably the band ringleader at the time, jumped ship. It is said that it was due to creative differences. Honestly? He went on to form Epica, whose debut album The Phantom Agony sounds pretty much like the natural continuation of Decipher, and it was a better album. On this album, After Forever released a concept album about a woman abused in childhood or something like that. No subtlety, some truly awful spoken word interludes and songwriting that just isn't on the same level as what came before. This album, unlike what came before, received rather average reviews and I must say I can't quite make my mind up if I like it or not. Some brilliant moments, but a concept like this needs the talent of a peak level Dream Theater or Pain Of Salvation to pull it off. After Forever give it their best shot, but it's obvious Mark Jansen left a huge void. It's fine. Floor sounds fine and pushes her vocals again, but I am just not too impressed by this one. I am intrigued now. Am I an After Forever fan or do I just really admire Mark Jansen? Because even poor Epica has more brilliance than this. Strange album. Talking with fans this is a love/hate album. Considering the band never quite recovered after this makes me think that, for the most part, they didn't win too many fans. Just one EP and two more albums left. I wouldn't be surprised if Prison Of Desire and Decipher are the best of the lot, because the bar was raised especially high by the latter.

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1 hour ago, laputa said:

Mark Jansen, brother of Floor

Nope, they just happen to share a surname.

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1 hour ago, laputa said:

 Talking with fans this is a love/hate album.

I'm definitely on the "love" side. It's my favorite After Forever album, and I can't understand how people can rate it 6/10 :mda:

It far surpasses the previous 2 imo, even though I'm also a big fan of Mark's work  (I actually bought tickets to a MaYaN show, and I almost never go to shows)

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4 minutes ago, NighttimeBird said:

I'm definitely on the "love" side. It's my favorite After Forever album, and I can't understand how people can rate it 6/10 :mda:

It far surpasses the previous 2 imo, even though I'm also a big fan of Mark's work  (I actually bought tickets to a MaYaN show, and I almost never go to shows)

I do think it needs repeat listens. I found the second listen much better than the first, and it has some moments that took me aback. Currently replaying Remagine and it's quite something!

Face Your Demons is an amazing song!

Also I always thought Mark and Floor were related. Sad times.

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3 hours ago, laputa said:

Mark Jansen, brother of Floor and arguably the band ringleader at the time, jumped ship. It is said that it was due to creative differences. Honestly

Well, he was forced to "jump ship", he was fired under the reasons of creative differences and that he didn't know how to read music (he never studied music in his life, just playing guitar by ear). And that was before heading to a whole European tour with NW and their first show at Pinkpop festival (2002), he was very angy. The good thing is that they made peace to each other with Sander and Floor, and I  will always admire Mark for being such an open minded person and not holding any grudge towards Floor or Sander. The guy is all about forgiveness and moving on.

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58 minutes ago, Damian said:

Well, he was forced to "jump ship", he was fired under the reasons of creative differences and that he didn't know how to read music (he never studied music in his life, just playing guitar by ear). And that was before heading to a whole European tour with NW and their first show at Pinkpop festival (2002), he was very angy. The good thing is that they made peace to each other with Sander and Floor, and I  will always admire Mark for being such an open minded person and not holding any grudge towards Floor or Sander. The guy is all about forgiveness and moving on.

Could you send me a link? Because I have been trying to find out more about these disputes!

I must say, Mark not being able to read music hasn't damaged his career at all. I am listening to The Quantum Enigma now and it's mind blowing! Also I played Remagine and that was a glorious album. I will come back to Invisible Circles and Exordium soon.

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Bit of a random comment, but Mark and Floor's cooperation didn't end after After Forever. Floor did some vocals on "Antagonise" while one of the most awesome songs of "Wild Card" features Mark's vocals. Some live material I found:
 

 

 

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^Floor was also a guest at Epica's "Retrospect" show and has appeared at other live shows of theirs in the past too. It's so good that Floor and Mark managed to reconcile and get back on good terms with each other. :)

"Invisible Circles" definitely took me a good few listens to appreciate. The lyrics are a bit on the blunt side, and the less said about the spoken word parts the better, but the songs themselves are really good. I loved the blend of the three vocalists, and the more progressive nature of some of the songs. And I appreciate what they did with the concept of the album, even if it wasn't executed perfectly.

That said, it took me a while to get into "Prison of Desire" and "Decipher" myself, so maybe it's a matter of taste.

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Yeah, acted parts of IC are not the best kind of radio-drama material you can get, but otherwise, the albums is superb, precisely because of brutally straightforward, yet eloquent lyrics. I find that Floor truly blossomed lyric-wise after Mark left AF. Before that, she just seemed to be looking up weird wannabe-fancy words in a random English dictionary, whereas Mark really tired me with his rants on narrow-mindedness of Islam. I kind of got it after the first two songs, no need to continue the whole Smothering saga till I got smothered. 

And music-wise, as well, no matter how much I like Decipher, Circles are still a giant compared to it. But then again, I could never grow to appreciate Epica, no matter how much I tried. 

And regarding Marc-AF relations, it is funny now to remember back when I was a member of AF forum around 2005-06, Marc joined the forum, and him and Sander opened a thread where they would together share episodes from the early history of the band. Needless to say, after only a few posts, some rather bizzare things were revealed (they first noticed Floor by her boobs, the rivalry between Marc and Sander was so great that one of the (forgot who it was) was secretly re-recording the other´s guitar parts for Prison of Desire session), so that apparently somebody got hurt by all these public revelations, so the thread died out. 

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31 minutes ago, Baki said:

And regarding Marc-AF relations, it is funny now to remember back when I was a member of AF forum around 2005-06, Marc joined the forum, and him and Sander opened a thread where they would together share episodes from the early history of the band. Needless to say, after only a few posts, some rather bizzare things were revealed (they first noticed Floor by her boobs, the rivalry between Marc and Sander was so great that one of the (forgot who it was) was secretly re-recording the other´s guitar parts for Prison of Desire session), so that apparently somebody got hurt by all these public revelations, so the thread died out. 

Wow. That's just... lol :P

As for post AF collaborations, I'm pretty sure that Sander was guest at an Epica show, where he did the grunts for Death of a Dream. And Floor was featured more heavily in Mayan's first album Quarterpast.

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2 hours ago, Baki said:

And regarding Marc-AF relations, it is funny now to remember back when I was a member of AF forum around 2005-06, Marc joined the forum, and him and Sander opened a thread where they would together share episodes from the early history of the band. Needless to say, after only a few posts, some rather bizzare things were revealed (they first noticed Floor by her boobs, the rivalry between Marc and Sander was so great that one of the (forgot who it was) was secretly re-recording the other´s guitar parts for Prison of Desire session), so that apparently somebody got hurt by all these public revelations, so the thread died out. 

wow :huh:, I knew there was tension, but secretly re-recording over a band members work sounds a little out there. It is kind of funny from an outsider's perspective though :giggle:

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7 hours ago, laputa said:

Could you send me a link? Because I have been trying to find out more about these disputes!

Sure. In this one he doesn't mention the part of the "don't know how to read music", but he did talk about the whole situation:

 

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