sahara

The Old Era

1,216 posts in this topic

On 1/16/2019 at 10:56 PM, Encaitar said:

I will appreciate it. :) I like reading different people's different opinions.

Well here you go then... all the way back to 2007. :P 

(It's evident that I did not write much about this era, because it turned out to be a looong post. Should I make it shorter? Naah...:whistle:)

Spoiler

Note: No infliction of drama intended. :) These are mostly my impressions from the past, and in the present I don’t intend to get into any debates about albums or singers because of this. #peaceandlove 
.

When those voiceover versions of some songs from DPP came out, I loved how they sounded. I remember I even put them on my mp3 player! It was different from their old sound, but it sounded good. (And ironically, I liked Bye Bye Beautiful the most.) So I was pretty positive about the album. I thought Eva sounded nice too. Oh, and I LOVED While Your Lips Are Still Red, I've listened to that song a lot.

So I obviously enjoyed Nw’s new music too.

I wasn’t closely following the album release, no idea why, there was no particular reason, I wasn’t a very active music fan back then anyway, but I had a friend who was looking forward to what they come up with, and I re-focused on them together with her when they started touring with Anette. We watched live videos on YouTube, and then - I was painfully disappointed. [I’ll spare you of the details. In a nutshell, I didn’t like neither the way she sounded live, nor her style in general.] So when I finally got to fully listen to the album I had that bitter feeling I got from the live recordings, that that is what Nightwish sounds like now and that I don’t like that sound/image at all...

I liked how the album sounded though. By and large. I liked the songs I’ve already heard, Amaranth not that much, but it was still catchy, TPATP and Sahara sounded great, The Islander and Last Of The Wilds as well, I could say I liked most of it, except for a couple of songs (MPG, and later 7DttW, CoHLB and MoH, with which I didn't really have a problem at the beginning but later I found myself skipping them). Anette sounded okay on it too, not what I would have wanted, but okay. And I loved The Islander video. Yet I couldn’t get rid of my mixed feelings towards the band, and continuously checking their live videos didn’t help at all either. (And watching fan-made side-by-side comparison videos about the old songs must have been the second most self-torturing thing I’ve ever done.) It was not the Nightwish I loved. It sort of turned into a love and hate relationship: I couldn’t ignore them because I still liked their music, but in the same time I didn't like them anymore.

And the funny thing was that this friend of mine wasn’t fond of Anette either, but apparently she liked Nightwish/Tuomas a lot more than I did, so I could say she was more “loyal” to the band, while I was (has just become) more the Tarja fan. So we were in the same boat, and in the same time we were not in the same boat. Probably that's why I tend to avoid online discussions about these matters. We've exhausted them from every angle possible. :P 

/ Ironically, again, she has not really been interested in Nightwish since ca 2010, while I am now here, writing about why I don’t like them “that much”. /

I had moments when I was more open towards them though, and in such a moment, in the spring of 2009 my friend came up with the idea to see them live, and I was like cool, why not, let’s go, it’s Nightwish after all! (Messy enough, right?) Seeing them live did not essentially change my opinion about them, but it eased the mixed feelings. We even met Marco, Tuomas and Emppu. So I got to the point that if I put aside my expectations about what I would have wanted them to sound like, even if I didn't like how they sounded as much as I used to, I could still enjoy their music.

For a while. Because while most of the DPP era felt like a toxic relationship, shortly after I got to the point that I was not annoyed by them anymore, I slowly also kind of stopped caring. I checked up on them of course when Imaginaerum came out, and that was a whole diffrent kind of mixed feelings (in a neutrally good way). I enjoyed that album in the sense in which I also enjoyed Amberian Dawn’s latest album now for example. But as a Nightwish album it was once again not what I would have wanted from them at all. But I was already estranged enough from the band that it didn’t bother me anymore, I made peace with the fact that this is what it is. I kept listening to the songs I liked, yet I did not follow them on tour neither online, nor live, then one morning when I logged in to facebook at the uni, I saw that for some reason a couple of friends of mine were shouting on my wall because of an article about Nightwish which came together with a picture of Floor Jansen and I was like whut?! ...

(And I was positive once again about the band. For a while. Because even for my surprise - despite the fact that I am now here, for various reasons - my estrangement keeps persisting.)

In the present I listen to songs from DPP occasionally, when they came up in my playlist and I am in the mood for them. It doesn't have my favorite Nw songs. TPATP is a great song, but not one I am in the mood to randomly listen to. The Islander, Sahara and The Escapist might be the ones I still enjoy going back too. (Actually, I am more often singing them than listening to them, haha.) And from Imaginaerum Song Of Myself. I used to really like TLTM, but l avoided listening to it for personal reasons lately...

By the way, around Christmas I was in the mood to properly revisit the old Nightwish, and I've listened to all the Tarja-era albums from start to finish (I very rarely listen to albums that way) while doing stuff in the house, sometimes together with my mom. It was great to realize how much I still love those albums. My mom seems to like Once the most, I think WIHAA, Sleeping Sun and White Night Fantasy are her favourite songs. And she loves Tarja's classical voice a lot.

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1 hour ago, Sophia said:

Well here you go then... all the way back to 2007. :P 

That was a delight to read.  :) thanks for writing!!!

I always like seeing people's NW history and perspectives...so yeah, I really enjoyed that.  It also fascinated me because I discovered NW a little bit after you did (after DPP had already come out) and my first experiences of NW included some of my very favourite songs from DPP (Islander, Poet, etc) so this album has always been a nostalgic favourite of mine, even though now it is not ranked near the top for me anymore :P 

It probably helped that I didn't really watch live videos back in the day (too busy with uni work - so just listened to songs on my mp3 player while walking to class usually!).  I wonder what I would have thought if I would have watched more live videos of Anette & band back then.  

Again it's fascinating because part of your journey mirrored mine in that I wasn't big into NW when Irum came out.  I obviously bought it (because nightwish!) but I didn't listen to singles or know anything about what was going on with band during that period.  I liked it ok but didn't think it was amazing.  I am sad I never got to see NW with Anette - just for the experience - so I am jealous of you that you were able to see her in person.  I missed her by about a month.  I got very early Floor though, so that's cool too :) 

I think it was sometime during beginning of 2018 I found my old NW albums and started listening to the old ones again...Century Child, Oceanborn, Wishmaster...Angels Fall First...and I fell in love with Tarja again.  I'm with your mom in that I love her classical voice.  So really - listening to old albums is what got me back into Nightwish this past year or so.  Obviously now I'm following the band again too, and sort of annoyed I didn't go see a Decades show!!

Agghh sorry I'm talking about myself now.  But anyway - really did like seeing some of the feelings (and reasons for those feelings) you have for DPP.  #peaceandloveindeed

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13 hours ago, Encaitar said:

That was a delight to read.  :) thanks for writing!!!

I always like seeing people's NW history and perspectives...so yeah, I really enjoyed that.  It also fascinated me because I discovered NW a little bit after you did (after DPP had already come out) and my first experiences of NW included some of my very favourite songs from DPP (Islander, Poet, etc) so this album has always been a nostalgic favourite of mine, even though now it is not ranked near the top for me anymore :P 

It was sort of cathartic to write it, so my pleasure! :) 

I think it matters a lot through which album one discovers a band. It will always be more special. I knew about Nw since around 2005 actualy, maybe late 2004. (I can't pinpoint the exact moment... I discovered them a bit after I got into WT and that was back then.) But my knowledge about them has been limited. I think I've heard Nemo, Wishmaster, TPOTO and The Siren and saw a fragment from FWTE, but that was all I knew from them. While from WT I had two albums at arm's length. But I thought they were cool, and I remember I was surprised when I heard about the split (from a magazine a colleague brought to class, I did not have internet connection back then, omg what times... And it came with a Nw poster and I remember I was lowkey disappointed that someone else asked for it before me. I even completely forgot about this detail until I recently came across an article I have put aside from around the same time.) So they've had my attention already back then, but it was unfortunately just later that I got to listen to their full discography and when I really got into them, retrospectively... And the rest is what I wrote above.

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I am sad I never got to see NW with Anette - just for the experience - so I am jealous of you that you were able to see her in person.  I missed her by about a month.  I got very early Floor though, so that's cool too  

Then it's kind of unfair that I did actually. :sweat: I mean we were sitting on a terrace at one point and we noticed Anette at the entrace of the nearby hotel with a couple of fans and we were asking ourselves whether we should go there or not. Eventually we didn't. I can't say I regret it, I think it would have been awkward and hypocritical if we did...

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Agghh sorry I'm talking about myself now.  But anyway - really did like seeing some of the feelings (and reasons for those feelings) you have for DPP.  #peaceandloveindeed

Don’t be sorry, all of us are mostly talking about ourselves/our opinions here, aren’t we? :P 

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7 hours ago, Sophia said:

Then it's kind of unfair that I did actually. :sweat: I mean we were sitting on a terrace at one point and we noticed Anette at the entrace of the nearby hotel with a couple of fans and we were asking ourselves whether we should go there or not. Eventually we didn't. I can't say I regret it, I think it would have been awkward and hypocritical if we did...

Right.  I understand.  I'm a bit annoyed with myself because I *could* have seen Anette live and almost did.  Maybe a year after I discovered Nightwish(either autumn of 2007 or spring of 2008, I still can't remember!), my friend that introduced me to them told me that we should see them in concert...they were playing two hours away from my uni, in my hometown!  So we bought tickets for the show (which was going to be in September 2008 I believe).  Sadly I made a TERRIBLE mistake.  I didn't have a car at the time and my grandmother wasn't going to need hers anymore...so my Dad and I planned to fly up to her town and drive the car back to where we lived.  My dad asked me for a good weekend to do this...I just told him a weekend in September and we bought plane tickets.  And YES...I had completely forgotten I had tickets to NW show that same weekend!!!  So I gave my friend my NW ticket and told him to find someone else to go with (he got a girl he liked to go with him, so wasn't too angry with me haha).  So that's my story of how I could have seen Nightwish in autumn of 2008...still kicking myself for that.

I'm glad you didn't go talk to Anette if you would have felt like a hypocrite haha.  So much cringe.  When you saw her live, were there any songs she sang that you really enjoyed hearing from her?  Just curious.

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Ohw... I'm sorry you couldn't make it to the show... But it seems it was a good opportunity for your friend, haha.

2 hours ago, Encaitar said:

I'm glad you didn't go talk to Anette if you would have felt like a hypocrite haha.  So much cringe.  When you saw her live, were there any songs she sang that you really enjoyed hearing from her?  Just curious.

From what I recall DCOW and Romanticide were fun. GLS wasn't bad either, she sounded surprisingly good in the chorus, she wasn't shouting in it unlike in certain other songs. The DPP songs are a blur... In general I left with the feeling that this was fun for a show, I enjoyed it, but her voice was waaay too light/sweet/childish/shouty for the music and that took away from the power of the songs.

And the fact that I saw Tarja live at a couple of months distance from the Nw shows singing songs like She Is My Sin, Sleeping Sun and The Kinslayer the way I loved them made it difficult for me to just accept the Nw show for what it was and ignore what it could have been.

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9 hours ago, Sophia said:

I think it matters a lot through which album one discovers a band. It will always be more special.

Generally speaking I'm sure this is true. I discovered them by downloading a couple of songs via LimeWire or something like that. This was back in late 2003, before iTunes and YouTube had much if any presence to speak of online. There was a thread about people's favourite singers on a video game forum, and someone mentioned Tarja. The description of the band's music really made me curious to hear it. The tracks I had downloaded were Deep Silent Complete and I believe also Wishmaster. But just hearing Deep Silent Complete was enough to sell me on this band. So I remember the anticipation for Nemo to drop, and then the album. Bought both on release day, and later saw them live during the Once tour in Malmö.

And while I love the songs on this album I've been on record many times as saying it feels very disjointed compared to the rest of their discography. I ended up listening to Century Child a lot more, which has become my favourite album. But I also listened a ton to Dark Passion Play. I've never had any issues with Anette's studio vocals, and something that I got used to during the Anette era was hearing more of Marco. He sings like 1/3 of the lead vocals on the album, as well as the demo versions and of course Kiss While Your Lips Are Still Red. I have to admit that I didn't pay too much attention to him before this album, and I still think him and Anette had the most compatible voices so far (he sounds great with Floor too though, and she has become my favourite out of all the female singers this band has had). I guess Anette's lack of ability to steal the show, and Marco being given more space is part of what made me open my eyes.

It wasn't just Marco though, but the rest of the band as well. Despite only having been a fan for a bit less than two years by the time Tarja was fired, in order to come to terms with it and realise what made it special I had to look beyond the majestic voice that had fronted it for so long. I came to realise that while Tarja's voice had drawn me in, it was the songwriting and musicianship from the rest of the band that had made me a fan. That being said, I would lie if I said that I felt like Anette didn't hold the band back in regards to performing the old material.

However, it all worked out in the end. Their current line-up is just perfect, even if I'd obviously be okay with Jukka coming back should they ever find a good workaround for his insomnia.

But I digress. For me, that one special album is Dark Passion Play for the reasons I've mentioned above. It wasn't my first, but it was the one that truly solidified my love for this band and their music.

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1 hour ago, Magnus said:

I discovered them by downloading a couple of songs via LimeWire or something like that. This was back in late 2003, before iTunes and YouTube had much if any presence to speak of online. There was a thread about people's favourite singers on a video game forum, and someone mentioned Tarja. The description of the band's music really made me curious to hear it. The tracks I had downloaded were Deep Silent Complete and I believe also Wishmaster. But just hearing Deep Silent Complete was enough to sell me on this band. So I remember the anticipation for Nemo to drop, and then the album. Bought both on release day, and later saw them live during the Once tour in Malmö.

This is scarily similar to how I discovered NW - back in 2003 too. I was also using Limewire and the music file I downloaded must've been incorrectly labelled, and it happened to be She Is My Sin. I was instantly captivated. 

It took me SO long to get over Tarja's firing, and it took me a good old of years to actually accept Anette. I NEVER once thought she was a bad singer at all, but I guess I was still "mourning". All the singers have brought such great variety to the music.

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5 hours ago, Magnus said:

For me, that one special album is Dark Passion Play for the reasons I've mentioned above. It wasn't my first, but it was the one that truly solidified my love for this band and their music.

I have to agree. I found out about Nightwish back in 2003 or something. I listened through Oceanborn, Wishmaster and Century Child and I loved them. Once was actually a bit of a dissapointment after them for some reason and I was truly shocked after they fired Tarja. BUT Dark Passion Play was the album that healed me. It made me realise what I loved most about Nightwish in the first place. It was the melodies, the stories and the musicianship. That album kind of proved why they are so special and without DPP I think I wouldn't be listening to them anymore. My favourite albums from them are Oceanborn, Century Child and Imaginaerum but Dark Passion Play still has a special place in my heart.

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So many similar stories to mine!! I discovered NW also back in 2003, a friend of mine was really obssesed with symphonic metal ( and back then I was more of a Nu metal kind of guy) and he was really loving what was NW's latest album back then, CC. Along came Evanescence, which I started to dig a lot and  my buddy told me that there were far better bands than them, and lend me an MP3 with NW's full discography up to the date (Side note: he also gave me one of WT and another one of Rhapsody (now Rhapsody of Fire/LT/FL Rhapsody)  and Therion). I listened to it and I liked it but didn't get really hooked. A year later I saw Once, FWTE and End of  Innocence on a record shop and bought them just out of curiosity. I really don't know why, as I stated before I liked them but they weren't my favorite band by any means. I watched them, paid attention to their lyrics...and started to really love them. Then soon after  I had a really low emotional period and CC helped me cope with it.  By that moment I had already fell in love with the band and got the opportunity to see them just a few days before Tarja was fired. And whn that happened I supoorted them. I knew that while I loved  Tarja's voice and presence, It was their lyrics and music that really hooked me in and that was not going to change without Tarja.  When Anette was announced I supported her, defended her and asked the haters to give her a chance. When DPP came out it also came out at a time when I did not know what to do with my life. It also helped me a lot through harsh times. So, yeah CC and DPP have a really special place for me.

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My story is also very similar to yours, Symphoniker. Although I think they became my favourites immediately.

I have the same experience with CC, and to an extent DPP.

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I discovered them in 2002, in a very mundane way - a friend of mine was wearing a T-shirt with NW promo photo from Wishmaster period, so I complimented the boobs of the girl on the photo (I was 15 back then, mind you), and then this friend told me it was one of her favourite bands, and eventually gave me AFF and CC to listen to. My previous experiences with metal were restricted to occasional Iron Maiden and Metallica, so really this opened a new world for me. Though I never became a metlhead, I did sort of start building my music taste with NW. 

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I don't remember almost anything... :cry: I was 9-10 years old back then and my earliest memory of NW is when I heard that Tarja was fired on the radio. The next memory is that my mom bought Century Child. And the next memory is that we bought all the other albums. But I can't remember the first time I actually listened to them! 

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Whenever that carpenter video was in jyrki (finnish telly program) have known them (around 96 -97?), still not the biggest fan but they have grown on me... lately i have mostly listened just some of their ballads over the years... 

 

I am actually bit suprised that angels fall first isnt as big ong as it could be... still one the of my faves...   that kind of honest passion and soul i hope to hear in nw doing in the future...

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I had a pretty long journey of aссepting Nightwish beyond Tarja. I found them in 2007/2008, I think, when I was only 7/8. I don't remember what exaсtly got me hooked, I know my older brother just thought I would like them (he was 15/16 at the time and really into them) and introduсed me to them. He really disliked the direсtion the band took with Onсe though, and while he tolerated that album, he simply сouldn't aссept DPP as the band he loved. He still сan't - when it сomes to NW, it ends with СС for him. So for the longest time, partly influenсed by him, I just didn't want to give the newer musiс a сhanсe. I had a very сhildish attitude towards the whole thing and no real reason to dislike Anette as muсh as I did - but then again, I WAS a сhild.

I aссidentaly сame aсross some videos from Waсken on YouTube in 2014, and that's when I found out that the band had a new singer. I really loved the way they sounded there, I really loved Floor. I guess that's when I finally understood that NW is more than Tarja and more than Anette. I didn't know half of the songs they played but they sounded wonderful to me. Ghost River in partiсular was the first song of the new ones that I fell in love with.

From there it all happened really fast, I had a сomplete сhange of heart in basiсally no time. Imaginaerum is now one of my favourites - I suppose it holds the plaсe of "the one that got me into the musiс" beсause while I had liked NW before that, I hadn't really embraсed them this way. And as a сhild you aссept the musiс differently, I сan't say that baсk then I appreсiated the early albums like I do now. In a way, Waсken and Imaginaerum were the gate baсk to Nightwish for me.

Or... I don't really know how to put it. Maybe this whole story is more about growing up than it is about NW. 2014 was when I finally started trying to find out what I like, and just like when I was little, NW was a vital part of that. They've always been there - there were just years and years when the only musiс I liked was from those same 5 albums of theirs. That's why I think I always like whatever it is they do - they are just suсh a big part of me. I сan't let go easily.

(I feel like a baby now, all of you found them in your teens or later in life in muсh earlier years than me - and here I am, having them as my сhildhood soundtraсk)

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