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Nightwish & Anette Media

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I'm just trying to work out what she is thinking.

Isn't this suppose to be promotion for her new album? Because when I'm reading these publications, it seems that more effort is going into talking about her time with NW than Shine. Sure reporters are going to try and push it because we know how much reporters like posting drama, but surely a response such as 'NW is my history and I've learned a lot, but the future is my solo and that's exciting so let's talk about that' is a wiser route and dare I say more grown up approach.

I mean, wasn't she writing a book about her time in NW. She can write whatever she likes to her hearts content there, why sacrifice what could be nice articles about her career future with talks that are starting to make her look bad. To me it just reads unprofessional. She can't be so insecure that she thinks that she needs to talk about NW and the split etc to get media attention for her solo surely?

 

I understand that she feels hurt and wants to get her story over, but with every interview I read (and the inconsistencies from them - which someone pointed out examples earlier) it reads more like a cry for attention to me.

 

I'm not saying who was in the wrong about the split and I'm trying to look at her interviews with an unbiased view, but I just can't understand her taking the route she did.

 

I suspect a lot of this is media/management driven. For example, I saw in the news Hilary Duff is separating from her husband. The same day, I saw in the news Hilary Duff is recording a new album. I wonder if these kind of reports are just "timed" by media in order to promote interest in the artist and subsequently album sales. Last year would not have been a good timing marketing-wise to do these interviews, I suspect that is why the decision was to do them now.

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In Metal Hammer UK's interview Anette  says that on the DPP tour she felt quite excluded because the guys "didn't WANT to speak English, so they didn't". It's difficult to believe that it would've been intentional - this language issue has been discussed here earlier too. And her sentence makes you wonder how did they manage to pass the tour without talking with her at all...? They've had some troubles in getting used to talk about everything in English, but Anette gives the impression that they didn't even try.

 

 

Another comment picked from that interview:  "On fan's reaction to the split, she says with a sigh: It's like a divorce, where the fans feel they need to take sides. Sometimes, even the one who CHEATED on the other gets all the support." Who might she mean... Then she wishes that people could say  "We don't need to hate these girls and say awful things about them." Really,  no hatred is needed, but she's been feeding annoyance herself quite a lot lately with her "unveilings".

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^I think a group of native Finnish speakers from Finland are likely to chat in Finnish amongst each other. We have study abroad trips for schools here in the USA, and although it's supposed to be an immersion thing, American students aren't barred from speaking English amongst themselves on their own time.

 

I am sure business was conducted in English (the songs are mostly English, the CDs are printed in English, 'night' and 'wish' are English words...) but at the same time of course they are going to speak a native language amongst themselves for things like jokes and idle chit-chat. It's only natural to speak your natural language (it's not a matter of wanting or needing to, just second nature). I can see how that could feel isolating, though. I've been in a room full of Vietnamese people speaking Vietnamese, and they didn't intentionally leave me out, but boy oh boy did I feel isolated with no one to talk to.

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I'm somewhat late with this and the whole interview makes me shake my head. If she wants to promote her album with digging up all the old stories from 2012, then good luck. The only point I can understand in some way is that she might have had a hard time if Floor stepped in only for a while during the pregnancy. Possibly not in Europe but in some other part of the earth.

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I just cannot believe what Anette says in that interview.

I remember when she joined the band and she got divorced from her husband writing in her blog that she won´t let anyone tell her anymore what to do - implying that in her marriage/previous relationships that had happened.

Now she´s implying the same thing about the NW guys.

She was not a young girl when she joined the band and she most definitely is not one right now. When is she going to take responsibility over her own behaviour and actions?

If she was fired from the band the way she says, who added the statement about the mutual agreement on her blog? Did the guys hack her blog? Was she forced to do it?

I think it´s pathetic and sad that she´s trying to draw a parallel between her exit and Tarja´s. In my opinion Tarja has grown and matured and she referred to Floor and NW saying that she had her own experience and Floor has hers. They cannot be compared and they are not the same.

 

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The timing for this so called dirty laundry was "well planned": new album and drama. Without mentioning Nightwish in every interview, Anette would not get this huge attention. I would call this ugly dirty business from her little carousel, which sadly makes all sparks of Shine blurred. Anette is probably not the brains behind this strategy, I wonder how well she actually understands how bad this kind of plan was for her. Throwing mud NOW has made her less sweet and delightful in my eyes, I am stunned and disappointed of this kind of behaviour.

 

 

Post edited for swearing. Please remember that the no swearing rule applies to workarounds too. - Dandelion

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In Metal Hammer UK's interview Anette  says that on the DPP tour she felt quite excluded because the guys "didn't WANT to speak English, so they didn't". It's difficult to believe that it would've been intentional - this language issue has been discussed here earlier too. And her sentence makes you wonder how did they manage to pass the tour without talking with her at all...? They've had some troubles in getting used to talk about everything in English, but Anette gives the impression that they didn't even try.

 

I wonder, what Troy has to say about the language difficulties. I mean, he does not speak Finnish either, does he? To me it is just one more lame argument she brings up now, when there is nothing else to be said. I agree with all the rest here, who say, that it gives you a bad taste in your mouth, that she is doing "dirty laundry" instead of only supporting her new album. All I ever see in her blog, her interviews and statements is "Me, myself and I". In my personal opinion she simply did not give enough contribution to the band. She only looked at it as a Job. Never wanted to be drawn into it too deeply.....

 

Fixed quote. -HooPee-

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Well, there won't likely be any big difficulties in communicating with Troy and Floor, not only because of language but also because of their mentality and sense of humour, they blend in much easier than Anette. Her interests seem to be pretty different... Or at least none of the guys has yet confessed to be obsessed in buying clothes and all kinds of nice stuff every other day. Sorry, this was a bit blunt...

 

But what comes to Troy, he has begun to learn Finnish too... This clip is from July 2012 when Nightwish played for the first time (hopefully not the last!!!) in Kuopio: warning... one indecent word included :D

 

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Seriously guys get off your high horses, this thread is disgusting, there is no discussion here from either the members or the moderators. There are only obnoxious jabs at her coming from left and right. You all "lost" respect for this woman, well I don't think any of you ever had an ounce of compassion to begin with for Anette who served the band for over 6 years and did her very best. If she wants to tell her story let her, and maybe try to keep an open mind that your precious nightwish band could make mistakes just as much as Anette can. This is such a toxic fan base, I read all of Anette's interviews regarding the split and they are not NEARLY as dramatic and dirt slinging as you all make it out to be. Could she be speaking only now of this to promote her album? Maybe. OR how about she was pregnant much of 2013 and had her newborn to take care of and needed to get her act together and think of her next move in her life and career. Why don't you all try to look at this situation with some sense of humanity and emotion regarding how she felt and feels now, whether it's anger or insecurity. You are all tearing her down with your speculation and causing more damage far more then her interviews are doing.

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@River Wild:

 

I don’t think there is anyone here who would question the fact that the most important thing for a pregnant woman is her and her baby’s health. I’m sure the fans know this and the band knows this too. The problem is that it seems that Anette herself would have wanted to risk her own and the baby’s health out of nothing more but pride. Just look at the band’s attitude to her situation. Nemo was rather little when they started the tour, so Anette asked for a separate tour bus for herself and her family. They provided it for her. No problem. Then she got pregnant again and when she told it to the band, they offered her to go on a maternity leave, which was seriously without doubt the best option. Just think about it… People here mentioned this a couple of times: she was above 40 when she got pregnant with her 3rd child and on top of that she was constantly sick in the middle of a heavy tour shcedule wich involved a lot of travelling. At first it seems she understood that it would have been the best for her and for the baby too to accept this. But then her pride came forward and she would have wanted to continue the tour in that condition. The problem is that she didn’t want to do this for her bandmates or for the fans, but only for herself. Just look at her (in)famous Britney/Rihanna post on her blog. Obviously cancelling a big part of the tour would have shown the fans more how much she cares about them, right? I do understand that she didn’t want to go through the whole vocalist-comparring-process again. But if she had considered herself a part, a real part of the band, then imo she should have trusted the other band members’ and the fans’ support about they wouldn’t turn away from her. You say that perhaps she needed the time to think about her future and to care about her newborn child after the split. Of course. But what did she actually do during that time? Gave little hints on her blog about how bad the band treated her. And again if you look back, you notice that the band actually did provide her everything she needed. But it seems nothing was good enough for her.

 

Honestly I always supported Anette when she was in the band (I got to know NW with her), and I would have had no problem with her telling her side of the story IF she does it right. It must have been a huge task for her to fill Tarja’s shoes and to deal with the haters. I don’t think any of us doubt that. However her attitude to the band, the fans and altogether to the music business personally changed my mind about her completely. If you read through her interviews, you notice that – as others mentioned this before too – she somehow never tells the same story twice and (to me) she even seems to make the story look more and more “spicy”. Just look at her comment about the guys not wanting to talk in English for example. Wasn’t this actually a citerion back then when they were looking for a new singer after Tarja that the new vocalist must have good English speaking skills? Obviously that was needed for being able to give interviews/talk to the fans around the world, singing the lyrics correctly, doing promotion etc, but also since they got demos from 55 different countries, the new singer was supposed to talk in English with the other band members/crew/management too. We make this look dramatic? Not really… People only being rational and express their shock about what they read in her interviews. Not because she says something really terrible, but because she says things that are simply not true and basically ridiculous. Like the English-speaking example above.

 

We are not tearing her down. It’s actually she who tears herself down. As Carol pointed out earlier, she could stop interviewers if they ask some uncomfortable questions about NW and instead focus on the future, her solo career and her new album. Doesn’t she say that she doesn’t look back and only moves forward? I’m not entirely sure. But if she does say this, then she doesn’t follow even her own principles. Her solo album is coming out in less than a month now, but because of interviews like these unfortunately we know next to nothing about it.

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I don't know why a ''not so good'' opinion about Anette has to be seen like we're not respecting her or like we don't like her work with NW, I can agree or not with her and I still like her albums with NW. I can't understand why people thinks we are some kind of conspiracy group that wants Anette's destruction. If she had recieved a lot of bad criticism is by her own mouth. Like I have said, I can not see the guys like the ''bad guys'' this time because they are doing NOTHING publicly against her, to me it doesn't matter if they wrote the infamous letter 8 years ago, this is another story. 

 

And, if I can add my own experience and I know I would sound totally cruel to some people, I'm one of those who traveled to see NW, I already had paid everything, I spent a lot of money just to see them because the concert was too far from my hometown, if someone would ask me ''what do you prefer: a canceled tour because of Anette's pregnancy or to see NW with another vocalist?'' I definitely choose to see them, even without a singer. Not many fans understand this position. It's not that we don't feel empathy to Anette, she just wanted something that was not an option for NW. 

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There are two objects for Anette Olzon's criticism in the Metal Hammer UK interview, i.e. the four Nightwish male band members and "the loyal NW fans". Anette sees the NW fans as people who did not like her, did not regard her as worthy for the band and made her feel so insecure that she probably didn't sing as well as she could have.

 

The real Anette haters were not NW fans, they were the band's anti-fans, and very few of them ever attended the NW gigs. People went to the gigs to enjoy the music and show and support the band including Anette. She did not always sing that well but she had versatility, and we fans believed that she has good social skills, so we supported her. There were also objective data and figures to confirm  that Nightwish was doing well with Anette, e.g. in half a year from 1/2012 to 7/2012 NW gained half a million new Facebook fans, their gigs sold well and the Imaginaerum album sold well on the declining record sales market.

 

Anette might have interpreted the great enthusiasm with which Floor was welcomed as a sign that a majority of the NW fans never liked her, which is not true. The fans were happy that NW did not need to discontinue the tour, Floor can sing the old catalogue and is a versatile and skilled singer. Still, those of us who liked Anette's vocals in Imaginaerum continue to do that in spite of Floor. We have been puzzled why Anette is not worried of losing her solo career fans when putting all the blame of the split on the NW guys. Perhaps Anette thinks that a majority of the NW fans already abandoned her soon after the split and there is no need to fear further fan losses. If Anette and her manager think in this way, they have misunderstood a lot.

 

I don't buy Anette Olzon's ranting in the Metal Hammer UK interview that we NW fans, being too critical to her, are to be blamed for her singing below her standard in gigs. The ultimate reason  for her sub-standard performances was the lack of skill, and vocal training would have helped for the problem. With better professional skill Anette would not have needed to be so much afraid of Floor, either. The NW songs are demanding, why did Anette not hire a vocal coach and start proper training after joining the band?  

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Honestly, I supported Anette every way I could during 2007/2008 (I wasn't even sad that they fired Tarja in 2005, so on the forums I was sooo pro-Anette), until she opened her blog.  

When she opened her blog and started blogging about totally frivolous stuff I initially felt disappointed, then I just gave up and stopped reading it because it was so poor of contents and some of the stuff she wrote was really childish. Maybe I did a mistake by expecting some maturity and interesting posts by a 36 years old singer.

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In a previous interview, I read that she did not want to risk her health by coming to South America again, because she didn't like the people here (so much for a racist), and then in this interview, she says that she could even make the South American tour even if she was pregnant with her baby. Yeah, it looks like she's a bit undecided about which story to tell.

 

Out of the few words read, it seems she's very insecure, the whole split was a huge mess; Nightwish is picking the "smartest" way of dealing with it (complete silence about the matter), and she's picking the definitely not smart move of speaking about it with the media. She should know better! Not to compare once again, but I remember that Tarja handled the departure quite differently, I even remember a video of her crying during a press conference which even made me cry because you could tell she was so frustrated. People can always express their feelings even to the media, just as long as they do it with consistency, without hypocrisy and with all self-respect.

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To the best of my knowledge, Anette never said anything racist. I think it's pretty obvious that after the Dark Passion Play tour, she did not want to go back to South America for a long time because of how badly she had been treated there. That's fully understandable. South American fans in general seem very passionate. At the time, South America was pretty much Tarja territory (meaning there were still lots of fans who could not accept a replacement for her). I think she wanted to go there during the Imaginearum tour because enough time had passed and she was hoping they had warmed up to her. Realistically speaking, I think having Nightwish tour there with Floor even as a temporary replacement for Anette would probably have made touring there with Anette to promote future albums even more awkward.

That being said, there is no way that the circus from the previous tour would be repeated just because Floor would step in. People still want Simone in Epica, flaws and all, even though Amanda Somerville (who is clearly the better singer out of the two by far) had been a temporary replacement for her during a tour in the past. At worst there would have been some fans daydreaming about "what if Floor had actually joined?", the same way people still wonder how things could have been if Tarja was still in the band. Anette wouldn't have received death threats, boos or being called nasty names for returning after maternity leave.

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^Eh, she probably would have, but there are some crazies everywhere you go that will say rude things to you for any reason whatsoever (anyone who has worked at a grocery store or a mall will understand this).

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What Magnus said

 

And by the way why the majority of South American fans act as they are mistreated by the rest of the world? It is almost a tendency to  say everyone, who is not familiar with their culture is racist, who hate "latino fans because they are not pale" (direct quote from FB page) . Accusing Anette for being racist because she said she had panic attacs in Brasil (no wonder, considering the death treats she resieved from some devoted fans), accusing Simone being a racist, because she doesn't like to be hugged and touched by strangers...Where's the logic here?  :blink: 

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They need to embrace the hypocritical self--people are more likely to be critical of traits in others that they are critical of in themselves.

 

Culturally, people touch to affirm respect. In Latin America, its hugs, kisses on the cheeks for greetings (There are some cultures who are more touchy, like in Laos, where businessmen must hold hands while in conversations). So, Europeans culturally don't do this. There is a cultural difference when Europeans go to Latin countries. So they feel disrespected. Then they profile Europeans as disrespectful. They are just projecting their negative feelings they have themselves, onto others, as I am sure is I the case in many situations.

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"So, Europeans culturally don't do this."  I am sorry but you've ever been to europe?

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Yes. I believe it's much more prominent in Latin America, I would have remembered a lot of kissing if everyone I met in Europe did it to me. I have not been to nearly every country though, there is a lot of culture I haven't experienced first-hand. The Dutch did not seem touchy to me.

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You got something wrong here. No problem to go for pm because we're both going very much off topic. This is about Nightwish, Anette, Media and not cultural issues. :)

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^Eh, she probably would have, but there are some crazies everywhere you go that will say rude things to you for any reason whatsoever (anyone who has worked at a grocery store or a mall will understand this).

 

I bet Anette will face more "comparisons" and "criticisms", let's say, she accepted replacement with Floor for a while. The reason is obvious that Floor is better than Anette, in terms of overall performance. So I believe I understood her fear of loosing her career on that side. On the other side, the band's financial matter will suffer on that area; so I guess, the parting ways was the only choice they have to do to avoid complications; unless the NW guys would want to postpone the tour.

 

They need to embrace the hypocritical self--people are more likely to be critical of traits in others that they are critical of in themselves.

 

Culturally, people touch to affirm respect. In Latin America, its hugs, kisses on the cheeks for greetings (There are some cultures who are more touchy, like in Laos, where businessmen must hold hands while in conversations). So, Europeans culturally don't do this. There is a cultural difference when Europeans go to Latin countries. So they feel disrespected. Then they profile Europeans as disrespectful. They are just projecting their negative feelings they have themselves, onto others, as I am sure is I the case in many situations.

 

Cultural differences is a wide topic, Kathleen. We, Asians have different deeds and such. But yeah, this is off-topic.

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I'm from a latin country, Italy. I guess I live in the cradle of latin culture and we're in Europe. And I'm sure that there's no such thing as "european culture". There are HUGE cultural differences within my country alone - which is even a small one -, let's not talk about a whole continent. Don't talk about culture if you don't even know what culture is.

 

Sorry for the OT.

 

Anette hasn't been nice to greek people either, but that's because she's lame at public speaking. I would call it stupid but not straightforward racist.

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Yes. I believe it's much more prominent in Latin America, I would have remembered a lot of kissing if everyone I met in Europe did it to me. I have not been to nearly every country though, there is a lot of culture I haven't experienced first-hand. The Dutch did not seem touchy to me.

 

OT: In the Netherlands we have this new thing, we women get kissed on the cheek three times, with or without shaking hands. More polite way is 'kissing in the air' (to keep it dry and not to ruin any make-up). Or the 'box' among guys, with or without shoulder patch. So you see, we aint that 'no touching'.

 

On topic: for Anette being 'cold'. I dont think it has much to do culture. If a lot of fans want to hug you or fight for your attention at the same time (because they want your autograph, or want to have your signature or have a picture taken with you), it can get very scary and bodyguards cannot  protect the celeb anymore. Lots of time its them who keep the celeb from going into a crowd / intermingling with the fans. I don't imply Anette has bodyguards outside a venue or event, but the venue has people who are hired for that job. Sometimes they just do their job, advising a celeb to keep a distance with the crowd.

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I know I laughed my squirrel off when one fan called Tarja a racist because she waved the Slovak flag on stage during her concert in Czech Republic (or vice versa, I forgot it) by mistake. 

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