GhostHell

The Upcoming Nightwish Album

680 posts in this topic

So, I guess it's time to start discussing the upcoming ninth album of Nightwish. We have almost zero information about it, despite that it will continue to deal with some themes of EFMB and it should be released, in the best scenario, at some point of 2019.

 

Well, in the lyrical sense, I think it would be interesting to have a vision of Tuomas regarding issues that persist in today's society, something more raw and visceral, just as EFMB has already given us a taste (with science and religion, though). Some band members seem to have a strong opinion about terrorist attacks and the motivation behind the people who perform such acts, and also about the fear that society develops because of that. I think there was also a very strong inspirational feeling from the band towards the fans during the EFMB era, and this might reflect on some lyrics of Nightwish #9, as far as the power of influence can go. I dunno, but I think there is a wide spectrum to be explored this time around. Floor also has incredible lyrics on some of these more visceral and societal issues, as seen in After Forever's albums, so I'd like to see her assuming the co-composition on forthcoming albums as well as Marco.

 

And speaking exactly about her, Tuomas can explore much more of the lady's vocal abilities. Floor can do lots of interesting things, vocally speaking, and I'd love to hear maybe a song heavily influenced by operatic vocals, something bordering Oceanborn or Wishmaster. A couple of songs also demanding the more aggressive side on the ReVamp vein, and more growls of course. She is simply a powerhouse.

 

I would also like to see Marco taking a few more lead vocals, rather than EFMB's backing vocals. And Troy has a wonderful voice that could be used more often as well. Regarding the drummer, we don't know who will be responsible for the drums of the next album, but Kai is incredibly talented, and I believe he can do great things during the creative process of the next album, however, I confess I would like to see Jukka coming back to his post too.

 

Anyway, there are so many things to discuss, let's start...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

* We'll hear new instruments from Troy.

* I guess the orchestra won't disappear – But we will have more band parts.

* I'm sceptical about more operatic vocals from Floor - Why didn't we have that in EFMB? Maybe Tuomas doens't want it.

* About the lyrics, I guess, it will be more about the millennium impact on the human evolution.

 

2017 will be tough. No new materials from NW. But it's all for good I think :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

* I'm sceptical about more operatic vocals from Floor - Why didn't we have that in EFMB? Maybe Tuomas doens't want it

Tuomas stated that Shudder Before the Beautiful originally was written with a lot of operatic vocals but during the recording Floor thought it fitted better with normal vocals :) so the idea was actually there. Hopefully we'll see some more operatic experimentation on Nw #9

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

* I'm sceptical about more operatic vocals from Floor - Why didn't we have that in EFMB? Maybe Tuomas doens't want it

Tuomas stated that Shudder Before the Beautiful originally was written with a lot of operatic vocals but during the recording Floor thought it fitted better with normal vocals :) so the idea was actually there. Hopefully we'll see some more operatic experimentation on Nw #9

 

Interesting! Where have you read it?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

More operatic vocals from Floor would be great and please get Marco to sing more lead vocals on the new album! I missed his voice on EFMB a lot. Also, Troy singing could be interesting. Maybe a song where all three have lead vocals together?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I really would love Floor's operatic vocals. I hope there is at least one duet with Troy as I really like his voice, is sweet and peaceful. What I'm not expecting are growls and/or screams. I think it would be so unnatural in NW. Unless it's one or two songs with guest artists (like Pharaoh and Devil). Though this may be because I don't like Floor's gutturals so much :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Things I need for the new album

 

- New sound elements. Preferably a radical departure.

- Professional, top class mixing and production. Think Los Angeles or London, no more Helsinki.

- Interesting, human lyrics, no more textbooks and eukaryothes.

- Use of Floor's ethereal and classical voices.

- No repetitive/recycled riffs.

- Kai. The one and only drum god.

- Good videos, preferably by Stobe Harku. No more Vile.

 

See, I'm easy to please.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

* I'm sceptical about more operatic vocals from Floor - Why didn't we have that in EFMB? Maybe Tuomas doens't want it

 

Tuomas stated that Shudder Before the Beautiful originally was written with a lot of operatic vocals but during the recording Floor thought it fitted better with normal vocals :) so the idea was actually there. Hopefully we'll see some more operatic experimentation on Nw #9

Interesting! Where have you read it?

Found it here: http://hardrockhaven.net/online/2015/04/interview-with-tuomas-holopainen-of-nightwish/

 

"For example, for the first song on the album, “Shudder Before the Beautiful,” we had much operatic vocals, originally. That’s what I had in mind, but it just didn’t work. It sounded prog. And then Floor took a different approach. And it started to work."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Things I need for the new album

 

- New sound elements. Preferably a radical departure.

- Professional, top class mixing and production.

- Interesting, human lyrics, no more textbooks and eukaryothes.

- Use of Floor's ethereal and classical voices.

- No repetitive/recycled riffs.

- Kai. The one and only drum god.

 

See, I'm easy to please.

What do you wish to see new? Explain yourself, I'm curious :)

 

Color removed, please stick to the original font color - WhiteRaven

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, to begin with, a professional band with huge budget should also have a decent sound quality, so they really should think again about production and mixing, perhaps even use a team that can make high quality audio...  :P I would also like a musical departure from EFMB, that album sounds so recycled and uninspired, and they really should make something new for a change. Perhaps let Marco and Floor do more songwriting. As many have stated, it would be nice to hear more lead vocals from Marco and classical vocals from Floor. I'd also like to hear more guitars, more interesting riffs and solos than on EFMB. Troy could be the 2nd guitarist on the songs that don't need his other instruments. And I also wouldn't mind another great long song...  :cool:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

More vocals by Marco

More operatic vocals by Floor

More gutturals by Floor

A duet Marco-Floor, the style of The Phantom of the Opera

More science and homage to the beauty of life, less childish fantasy stuff

A couple of long guitar solos by Empu

More ethereal guitars by Troy

Another twenty minutes song

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hmmm... well, in general:

 

- Moving away from the style of their previous 4 albums. The more I listen to them, the more I feel like they reached the pinnacle of their symphonic, soundtrack-esque compositions with "Imaginaerum" - I really don't think they're going to better that, and for me, EFMB felt a bit like "more of the same". I did appreciate the steps towards a more band focused sound, and I'd like to see them continue in that vein. They now have a solid line up, they have access to Troy's folk instruments as well as a second guitarist when the need strikes, they have 3 very good vocalists including Floor who has the ability to sing in a variety of styles. I think they have the ability to create something different from their early sound without having to rely on guest players or synth patches now, and whilst I doubt we'll ever see the orchestra disappear completely, I would like to see its role reduced. After being much praised for changing from their earlier power metal sound, I think it's time for them to make another change before they start to stagnate.

 

- Use the vocals more creatively. I like the way they've used Troy (TEOSG) and Floor (TGSOE) to provide atmosphere and sound without lyrics, I'd quite like to see more of that. Given Troy's lovely soft voice and how well Marco can sing soft ballads, I'd like to see something that's vocally in the vein of "Rest Calm" but reversed - the guys providing the softer sounds while Floor tackles the heavier/ faster side. It would be something a bit different to the usual "Beauty and the Beast" vocal split of a lot of their contemporaries. And whilst I'm not overfond of Floor's operatic vocals, it would be good to hear them used as an element of the band's sound to give them a bit more variety. Perhaps more like "Bless the Child" or Floor's "Storytime" rather than "Stargazers" - the operatic vocals used at certain points of the song to give variety, rather than forming the main basis for the vocals. I may be in a minority here though :P

 

- Sort of linked to the above, but just for emphasis, more belting from Floor. She's got a great voice, and it was lovely to hear her soft voice get a bit more focus for once. But for me, if I listen to Floor Jansen it's because I want to hear a voice powerful enough to knock a door down. More in the vein of "Weak Fantasy", or that last "Floorgasm" in GLS please.

 

- It would be interesting to have some more songwriting input from Floor, Troy etc. I feel like that might help them reach that new, fresher sound.

 

- The more optimistic, positive lyrics have been a positive change for me. The Dead Boy can stay gone :P I'm somewhat indifferent to the "overtly science-y" lyrics. It's definitely an interesting concept to deal with on an album but a couple of the songs (especially EFMB and parts of TGSOE) came across as a little dry and textbook style compared to songs like My Walden or Elan.

 

 

I would love to see John Two-Hawks again with Nightwish too!

 

I think that's unlikely. There was some controversy a few years back (we're not supposed to discuss it further but there's probably a thread in the Graveyard that might give you more of an overview) which the band was aware of - they may not wish to reopen that discussion by inviting John Two Hawks for another appearance. I could be wrong, of course.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would really like them to get together and come up with something that further explains their thoughts about religions. I'd like the album to have heavier guitar parts...somewhat like Epica's Divine Conspiracy. Of course not a copy of that sound...that is Epica...and Nightwish is Nightwish. I wouldn't mind some operatic vocals...but I'm with everyone else in this world...let Floor contribute more. Let her write and sing...let her be free to growl a little if she wants to.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

They now have a solid line up, they have access to Troy's folk instruments as well as a second guitarist when the need strikes, they have 3 very good vocalists including Floor who has the ability to sing in a variety of styles. I think they have the ability to create something different from their early sound without having to rely on guest players or synth patches now, and whilst I doubt we'll ever see the orchestra disappear completely, I would like to see its role reduced. After being much praised for changing from their earlier power metal sound, I think it's time for them to make another change before they start to stagnate.

Yes, this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hmmm... well, in general:

 

- Moving away from the style of their previous 4 albums. The more I listen to them, the more I feel like they reached the pinnacle of their symphonic, soundtrack-esque compositions with "Imaginaerum" - I really don't think they're going to better that, and for me, EFMB felt a bit like "more of the same". I did appreciate the steps towards a more band focused sound, and I'd like to see them continue in that vein. They now have a solid line up, they have access to Troy's folk instruments as well as a second guitarist when the need strikes, they have 3 very good vocalists including Floor who has the ability to sing in a variety of styles. I think they have the ability to create something different from their early sound without having to rely on guest players or synth patches now, and whilst I doubt we'll ever see the orchestra disappear completely, I would like to see its role reduced. After being much praised for changing from their earlier power metal sound, I think it's time for them to make another change before they start to stagnate.

 

- Use the vocals more creatively. I like the way they've used Troy (TEOSG) and Floor (TGSOE) to provide atmosphere and sound without lyrics, I'd quite like to see more of that. Given Troy's lovely soft voice and how well Marco can sing soft ballads, I'd like to see something that's vocally in the vein of "Rest Calm" but reversed - the guys providing the softer sounds while Floor tackles the heavier/ faster side. It would be something a bit different to the usual "Beauty and the Beast" vocal split of a lot of their contemporaries. And whilst I'm not overfond of Floor's operatic vocals, it would be good to hear them used as an element of the band's sound to give them a bit more variety. Perhaps more like "Bless the Child" or Floor's "Storytime" rather than "Stargazers" - the operatic vocals used at certain points of the song to give variety, rather than forming the main basis for the vocals. I may be in a minority here though :P

 

- Sort of linked to the above, but just for emphasis, more belting from Floor. She's got a great voice, and it was lovely to hear her soft voice get a bit more focus for once. But for me, if I listen to Floor Jansen it's because I want to hear a voice powerful enough to knock a door down. More in the vein of "Weak Fantasy", or that last "Floorgasm" in GLS please.

 

- It would be interesting to have some more songwriting input from Floor, Troy etc. I feel like that might help them reach that new, fresher sound.

 

- The more optimistic, positive lyrics have been a positive change for me. The Dead Boy can stay gone :P I'm somewhat indifferent to the "overtly science-y" lyrics. It's definitely an interesting concept to deal with on an album but a couple of the songs (especially EFMB and parts of TGSOE) came across as a little dry and textbook style compared to songs like My Walden or Elan.

 

 

I would love to see John Two-Hawks again with Nightwish too!

 

I think that's unlikely. There was some controversy a few years back (we're not supposed to discuss it further but there's probably a thread in the Graveyard that might give you more of an overview) which the band was aware of - they may not wish to reopen that discussion by inviting John Two Hawks for another appearance. I could be wrong, of course.

Oh, what a pity. I really liked this guy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can't help but feel a little guilty in discussions like these, because I don't want to give the impression that the previous album's lasting appeal wasn't good... But it's only natural to look forward to more of something you love, am I right? :)

 

For me, Nightwish have earned a position where they could release almost anything and I will like it for what it is. Doesn't mean I'll enjoy it, though I likely will. But it's important that they are true to themselves and make music that's authentic. On the other hand, we're consumers, and I do have a wish list...

 

It's time to stir things up. EFMB was an excellent safe card.

 

- Previous album nailed the narrative, now it's time to focus on the music itself. Letting the songs write themselves isn't always a good thing.

- More instrumental parts/fully instrumental songs. (Last of the Wilds style, not Eyes style.)

- Less predictable song structures and repeating motifs. This is a tough one since you can't force it either.

- Songs led by a certain instrument, or vocals. Especially guitar or keyboards!

- More metal, but also less metal. I don't understand this one either.

- Also more acoustic and folk elements.

- More vocals by Marco and especially Troy. The harmonies on EFMB are already so awesome. When was the last time we had a proper duet, by the way?

- Save the orchestra for where it has the greatest impact. Choir is in a good spot as is, I think.

- That E-bow.

- Proper mastering and all that everyone agrees on.

 

And when it comes to lyrical themes it's anything goes for me...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I really like what we suggest here. But I wish that they'll make their music as they want and not as how we want it to be heard. This is the way it will be REAL NW sound.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I really like what we suggest here. But I wish that they'll make their music as they want and not as how we want it to be heard. This is the way it will be REAL NW sound.

Well, you can be sure that's exactly what's going to happen.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

I really like what we suggest here. But I wish that they'll make their music as they want and not as how we want it to be heard. This is the way it will be REAL NW sound.

Well, you can be sure that's exactly what's going to happen.

 

Sure. Just shared my thoughts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Interesting to think about.

 

I don't mind staying in the realm of science. Science can be explored in so many ways. Epica has proved this time and time again with how Mark Jansen approaches science in his writing.

 

What I would love to hear:

 

  • Floor's voice accessed to it's full potential. With no more ReVamp, I hope Nightwish takes over in allowing Floor to use those amazing powerhouse vocals we got with After Forever and ReVamp. It would be a shame to lose that. And of course that doesn't mean her not singing in her gorgeous softer vocals she did on EFMB, but, writing some powerful songs to fulfill those possibilities too needs to happen.
  • More than one nice ballad. After Floor slayed "Sleeping Sun," I want to hear her do more ballads with them.
  • Giving Floor some power in writing the songs.
  • Going along with that, a new sound is needed. For that evolution to happen, I think Marco, Floor, and Troy need a bit more room to add their touches to the songs.
  • More Marco vocals.
  • More Troy vocals.
  • Troy on guitar. I loved his work during the live shows.
  • Another epic. The Greatest Show on Earth was incredible.
  • More songs along the veins of Yours Is An Empty Hope, Weak Fantasy, and Alpenglow.

 

Hopefully Tuomas is inspired to write this year. And perhaps Floor's new experience as a mother will have her writing too and wanting to contribute her own lyrics to this album.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh, that's interesting. Let's see...

 

- Using Floor's ethereal vocals a bit more. Please. Please. I'm not really fond of the style of operatic vocals she uses on Stargazers, for example (please don't burn me on the stake), but those vocals at the beginning of TGSOE, oh god, oh, god, GIVE. ME. THAT.

In the same vein, I love the way she sings ballads, I just can't get enough of her Sleeping Sun and the backing vocals she provides on The Islander and WYLASR. Seriously, these songs must be my favourite thing about VoS.

Basically... Let her be gentle.

Also, of course, make use of her aggressive style - like in YIAEH or Weak Fantasy.

 

- Someone wrote "more metal, but also less metal" a few posts ago and I agree. I can't explain either, but I've been thinking this exact thing lately.

Though you know what, forget that. All I really want is more of the NW magic, and I think it would be hard to dissapoint me in this regard. There has always been something more than music about them. They just make me feel and I love the way they do it. As long as this is not lost, it's all good. I'm fine with them changing their style, I'm fine with them staying similar (as long as they don't write the same songs over and over again, of course), I just need the magic. (EFMB was a bit drier, but fortunately, it still worked. I just hope it will... how do I say it... work just a little bit better next time.)

 

- It's been said already, I'll say it again - MARCO. More Marco on vocals, please. And also more Troy, his voice is so gentle and beautiful.

 

- Regarding the lyrics, I think everything could work for me. I actually love "the childish fantasy stuff", but I did like EFMB a lot - excluding the "textbook stuff". Basically, make it beautiful and poetic and you can make me enjoy the lyrics to a song about almost anything. (within some boundaries, but I doubt Tuomas is the one to go beyond them)

 

- Solos. Emppu, Tuomas, use the year break to practice and then come back with some killer solos for the new album. :P

And I would love to hear some more keyboards... But maybe it's just the piano player in me. :D

 

 

But all in all... Whatever they do, I'll probably like it - it just needs the NW feel.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

More. Vocals. From. Marco. 

 

Seriously, he was almost criminally underused in TGSOE. The duets he could do with Floor would be breathtaking. I strongly disagree with those who want Troy to have more vocals; just listen to Ghost River and you can hear the chemistry and power behind Marco and Floor's voices. The more vocals Troy gets, the less Marco will be able to sing. That's the last thing the new album needs; Marco taking on another diminished and backing role. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now