GhostHell

The Upcoming Nightwish Album

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- Less soft and slow songs and most definitely never again a 6 minute soft instrumental with a 6 minute soft intro afterwards

- Less narrations and fluff in general, at least 15 minutes could have been cut from both Imaginaerum and EFMB

- Even though SBtB is a great song, I don't want to hear the MPG/Storytime riff reused for the fourth time on the next album

- A song like Devil and the Deep Dark Ocean would be nice, dark, fast and melancholic

- Vocals mixed higher than EFMB

- Some songs that take you to another place on first listening, EFMB was really bad on first listening and only became great later

- Fresh melodies, but this is a given. EFMB lacked this because the Scrooge album took all the fresh things out of Tuomas

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So, I guess it's time to start discussing the upcoming ninth album of Nightwish. We have almost zero information about it, despite that it will continue to deal with some themes of EFMB and it should be released, in the best scenario, at some point of 2019.

I'm not sure about 2019. These articles suggest a new album could possibly arrive in 2018:

 

http://teamrock.com/news/2016-04-29/nightwish-future-planned-out-says-tuomas-holopainen

http://teamrock.com/news/2016-11-07/next-nightwish-album-to-continue-endless-forms-themes

 

If it does arrive in 2018, it will almost definitely be near the end of the year. I'm really hoping for a 2018 release, but that might not happen if the band takes a break during the entire 2017 year and then expect them to produce an entire album during 2018 for a release near the end of the year.

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So, I guess it's time to start discussing the upcoming ninth album of Nightwish. We have almost zero information about it, despite that it will continue to deal with some themes of EFMB and it should be released, in the best scenario, at some point of 2019.

I'm not sure about 2019. These articles suggest a new album could possibly arrive in 2018:

 

http://teamrock.com/news/2016-04-29/nightwish-future-planned-out-says-tuomas-holopainen

http://teamrock.com/news/2016-11-07/next-nightwish-album-to-continue-endless-forms-themes

 

If it does arrive in 2018, it will almost definitely be near the end of the year. I'm really hoping for a 2018 release, but that might not happen if the band takes a break during the entire 2017 year and then expect them to produce an entire album during 2018 for a release near the end of the year.

 

 

It seems you've missed a lot. There's going to be a tour during 2018 (already confirmed) and, apparently, it's going to be a golden oldies tour (there are some hints here and there). So no new album in 2018.

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Interesting to think about.

 

I don't mind staying in the realm of science. Science can be explored in so many ways. Epica has proved this time and time again with how Mark Jansen approaches science in his writing.

 

What I would love to hear:

 

  • Floor's voice accessed to it's full potential. With no more ReVamp, I hope Nightwish takes over in allowing Floor to use those amazing powerhouse vocals we got with After Forever and ReVamp. It would be a shame to lose that. And of course that doesn't mean her not singing in her gorgeous softer vocals she did on EFMB, but, writing some powerful songs to fulfill those possibilities too needs to happen.
  • More than one nice ballad. After Floor slayed "Sleeping Sun," I want to hear her do more ballads with them.
  • Giving Floor some power in writing the songs.
  • Going along with that, a new sound is needed. For that evolution to happen, I think Marco, Floor, and Troy need a bit more room to add their touches to the songs.
  • More Marco vocals.
  • More Troy vocals.
  • Troy on guitar. I loved his work during the live shows.
  • Another epic. The Greatest Show on Earth was incredible.
  • More songs along the veins of Yours Is An Empty Hope, Weak Fantasy, and Alpenglow.

 

Hopefully Tuomas is inspired to write this year. And perhaps Floor's new experience as a mother will have her writing too and wanting to contribute her own lyrics to this album.

 

I'll add on to my own post.

 

While I want to hear more vocals from Troy, I do want less pipes.

We had some great songs on EFMB that featured them heavily, but, I want something heavy again. Yours Is An Empty Hope and Weak Fantasy were fantastic for that.

 

More Dark Chest of Wonders, 10th Man Down, Slaying the Dreamer.

 

With Floor's amazing powerhouse voice, I very much want to see that used and exercised.

 

On the flipside, I really do want a wonderful powerhouse ballad on the veins of Sleeping Sun.

 

I do hope Tuomas finds a new sounds. Still staying true to what is "Nightwish," but, with some help from Marco, Empuu, and Floor. Floor is heavy in her writing, and I want to see that.

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Floor is heavy in her writing, and I want to see that.

 

I don't know what to think about this. It's like I want to see Floor getting into Nightwish songwriting, but at the same time I'm not really a fan of the songs she has written. So... It's a double-edged sword for me.

 

By the way... The capital letters for The Upcoming Nightwish Album are T.U.N.A. Is this a sign that they should release an album purely dedicated to edible fish?

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Yes, I know, but "Ulterior Motiv" is written with a different mindset, and that type of song writing would bring a lot of variety to Nightwish. 

I have always felt that after Once they should have moved into a slightly more progressive direction, with less "structure" and more playfulness in their songs.

They could always keep the melodies that they are known for, and some orchestra is always welcome, but not to the extent that they are now using.

They have members that are familiar with this type of song writing and they have shown small tendencies to play in the borderline at rare occasions.

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If I remember it was one of the Nightwish "making of EFMB" vignettes.  Tuomas said they tried the classical vocals , but they ended up agreeing the song worked better clean.

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When I listen to Imaginaerum, I find a strong unison and coherence in every single song, that makes the album great. Unfortunately, I don't find such kind of magic touch in EFMB, some thing about it seems very disjointed to me. So, I truly hope that the future album will be more soulful and connective, just like irum.

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When I listen to Imaginaerum, I find a strong unison and coherence in every single song, that makes the album great. Unfortunately, I don't find such kind of magic touch in EFMB, some thing about it seems very disjointed to me. So, I truly hope that the future album will be more soulful and connective, just like irum.

That's funny, because I barely listen to Imaginaerum exactly because of it. I think that every song from it is so connected to the other and entwined to the same concept, that makes it hard to listen the song by itself, except for a few like IWMTB or Rest Calm.

 

Even though EFMB has the science-themed stuff going through it, I find the songs on the album much more easy-listening on that aspect. I can pick Yours Is an Empty Hope or Alpenglow any day of the week and get a different vibe and meaning everytime.

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The more and more I think about it the one thing I desire more than any other for the next album (apart from Jukka; but that seems to be an impossibility) is a lot less Troy. I don't just mean his vocals (I've already posted on that; when you have a male singer like Marco you don't need any other male vocalist) but the pipes and his other instruments as well. A return to the bombastic and heavier style would be perfect IMHO and it doesn't need more and more of Troy's influence. There was far more of Troy on EFMB than ever before (to be expected; given it's his first album as a member of NW) but it really skewered the band away from heavy metal territory and into folk metal. I think that such a large presence on future albums will grow tiring very quickly, especially if he starts taking guitar parts off Emppu. His songs and his instruments work so much better in small doses; that's why IWMTB was such a great song off Imaginaerum, it was totally unexpected and refreshing. My Walden didn't have the same effect on EFMB because we'd heard the pipes on so many of the preceeding songs. If the new album could take a step back from Troy and back into the heavy atmosphere of previous albums, I really think it would be better off. 

 

While on the subject of Troy's increasing input; I also fear that their live concerts may suffer due to his instruments; be it by only choosing songs that feature an instrument he can play or adding in unnecessary instrumental segments to songs that were perfect without them; just look at the opening of Nemo in Wembley where the piano solo segment was given a pipe backing piece. If that's the road NW go down in their live shows; adding new layers of instrumentals that give Troy something to do in every song then I greatly worry that the songs will become tarnished. 

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A return to the bombastic and heavier style would be perfect IMHO

A return from what? It never left, I'd say we're kinda tired of that. EFMB has the most guitar composition wise (perhaps not mixing wise but that's acceptable) since Wishmaster. If anything they shiould not try to top Once again, 15 years later. Time for a new sound.

When I listen to Imaginaerum, I find a strong unison and coherence in every single song, that makes the album great. Unfortunately, I don't find such kind of magic touch in EFMB, some thing about it seems very disjointed to me. So, I truly hope that the future album will be more soulful and connective, just like irum.

Disjointed is the perfect term to describe everything about EFMB.

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I'll just allow myself to bring some counter-arguments to "less Troy"... :)

 

Saying that you don't "need" another male vocalist when you have Marco seems kinda... shortsighted to me. For one, three vocalists allows for (not enforces) more elaborate vocal work than two. We have a few songs where Floor sings the melody and Marco does harmonies. This works on its own, but Troy singing the melody as well, an octave lower, adds another layer of depth. It's not "essential" to the song, but I would never want it taken away. Second, this is music - art! Marco and Troy have different voices, and songs written with their respective voice in mind probably wouldn't be the same, since just because you can sing something doesn't mean it wouldn't sound more authentic/fitting (depending on the genre, story etc.) with someone else's voice! Of course, we don't know if there will ever be any such songs...

 

In what way has Troy's instruments taken too much room? Guy plays the flute, which has been a part of Nightwish's sound since Angels Fall First. And I still kinda want more of it at this point. As for the pipes I somewhat agree... I don't think they need to be fully put to rest, but maybe have their role changed a bit. I keep saying I'm all for more folk in the future, but that doesn't mean Élan/My Walden pipe hooks that's just the chorus melody anyways. The final part of My Walden is awesome, because there's a whole other kind of build-up, followed by the pipes really being highlighted, bringing something new...

 

Beyond that he's only credited for bodhran and bouzouki which only appear in - I quote - "small doses". The changes to Nightwish's musical style is the result of much more than just "Troy's influence", I believe. One thing is certain: the direction in which Nightwish will take their music from here on is the one they feel is right. I would be really excited for a step backwards to a dark, heavy, bombastic Dark Passion Play/Imaginaerum/something in between style, but it doesn't feel realistic. It has proven to be difficult to explain what I would want from them going forward instead, though it would be less predictable, less "single-friendly", and definitely bring back the organic, the roots. More nature. Go softer, and heavier. Something new!

 

About live concerts... I feel kinda sad when Troy is not there on stage with the others, which is during several songs... Here's the thing: he has been with the band for almost ten years. I think they've figured out by now how to keep a good balance and the band happy. There is lots of potential using him as a second guitarist. The idea of him stealing Emppu's parts is ridiculous. Adding new instruments to old songs I can accept being a matter of taste. I think Nemo from Wembley is the ultimate performance of the song ever, while some might find the flute unnecessary...

 

...

 

A true ballad or two on the next album would be pretty sweet! :D

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I think we're exaggerating Troy's influence. Well, there are probably too many flutes on EFMB, but folk's elements have been present in NW sound for ages. I agree, anyway, that whistles, pipes and flutes shouldn't gain too much space, but I'm sure that's not going to happen. On the next album we'll have more Troy than in EFMB, but as a guitarrist, which is very promising because I love the way he plays, completely different from Empu.

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Here is a brand new interview with Troy, where he talks a bit about the actual musical direction of the band and the upcoming album. Thought it was nice to share:

 

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Troy we all love you, but there is absolutely no need to throw unnecessary jabs at Tarja or her fans. You weren't in the band back then, ergo, it is none of your business. 

On topic, I'm already really excited about the new album! 

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! really only have one wish for the next record. My wish is to see them continue to produce their own unique music. I'm sure they will do that...and I believe their next album of songs will be great. I can't say that any Nightwish record has disappointed me...I'm not sure i have a favorite Nightwish album...and I believe Floor will be used to her full ability this time around. That's what is going to be most interesting to me...to see how Floor uses her vocal talents on the next album. She might even be able to do a small amount of growling vocals! Maybe that is the only thing new i want to hear? If growls are introduced...doesn't that scream for more aggressive musical backing?

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What would I like to see? How about a 25-30 minute song with the orchestra on full epic massiveness.

 

Also a song in Finnish would be really cool!

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What would I like to see? How about a 25-30 minute song with the orchestra on full epic massiveness.

 

Also a song in Finnish would be really cool!

Oh yeah. 

 

And more songs like SBTB. Such an epic song that blows your mind.

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Sorry, but I don't get it. If you can't stand it why do you want more of it?

Sorry, not a native speaker. It wasn't my intention. Fixed.

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Ah, sorry. I wasn't sure if you were kidding or just had mistaken "stand" and "resist". I'm not a native speaker either. I agree with you though. I want more songs like SBTB and TGSOE, both of them are amazing.

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Don't know if it has been posted before, but I think perhaps it would be a good idea for the next album if Floor is mixed more prominently during the classical choirs (a bit like the live version of Shudder Before The Beautiful). In that way there are no 'forced' classical vocals into the music where they don't fit in, but Floor's ability to sing classical is still used. 

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